15 West Kellogg Blvd.  
Saint Paul, MN 55102  
City of Saint Paul  
Meeting Minutes - Action Only  
Legislative Hearings  
Marcia Moermond, Legislative Hearing Officer  
Mai Vang, Hearing Coordinator  
Joanna Zimny, Executive Assistant  
Tuesday, May 9, 2023  
9:00 AM  
Room 330 City Hall & Court House/Remote  
9:00 a.m. Hearings  
Remove/Repair Orders  
Ordering the rehabilitation or razing and removal of the structures at 901  
FULLER AVENUE within fifteen (15) days after the March 22, 2023, City  
Council Public Hearing. (To refer back to April 11, 2023 Legislative Hearing)  
Layover to LH June 13, 2023 (June 21 CPH) for update on foreclosure filing by property  
representative. $5,000 PD to be posted no later than COB June 1, 2023.  
Laid Over to the Legislative Hearings due back on 6/13/2023  
Ordering the rehabilitation or razing and removal of the structures at 829  
THIRD STREET EAST within fifteen (15) days after the May 17, 2023, City  
Council Public Hearing.  
To refer to June 27, 2023 Legislative Hearing. By no later than COB June 23, 2023 PO  
to submit: work plan including schedule and bids, proof of financing sufficient to  
complete the rehab, affidavit dedicating funds to the project, and property must be  
Minutes pending.  
Referred to the City Council due back on 5/17/2023  
Ordering the rehabilitation or razing and removal of the structures at 871  
STICKNEY STREET within fifteen (15) days after the June 14, 2023, City  
Council Public Hearing.  
RLH RR 23-21  
Remove within 15 days with no option to repair.  
Referred to the City Council due back on 6/14/2023  
10:00 a.m. Hearings  
Making Finding on Nuisance Abatements  
Third Making finding on the appealed substantial abatement ordered for 698  
DESOTO STREET in Council File RLH RR 22-16.  
RLH RR 23-23  
The nuisance is abated and the matter resolved.  
Referred to the City Council due back on 5/24/2023  
Making finding on the appealed substantial abatement ordered for 1457 THIRD  
STREET EAST in Council File RLH RR 22-24. (Public hearing continued to  
May 10, 2023; Legislative Hearing on May 9, 2023)  
Public hearing continued to May 17, 2023. Owner to provide 1) financial information  
supporting already submitted affidavit and 2) updated spreadsheet including plumbing  
bid by May 16.  
Jodi Savasten- Via Phone  
Dale Savasten- Via Phone  
Moermond: Good morning, Dale and this is Marcia Moermond at the City Council. Are  
we calling Jodi separately or she with you?  
Mr. Savasten: Yeah. You mind calling her in separately?  
Moermond: Not problem. We'll do it right now.  
Mr. Savasten: Okay. Thank you.  
Moermond: Good morning, Jodi, and Dale. I am Marcia Moermond from the City of  
Saint Paul City Council. I am calling you both into the hearing about 1457 Third Street  
East. We received your documents yesterday. I should tell you I have in the room. Mr.  
Joe Yannarelly and Mr. Clinton Zayne. They both over at the City's Department of  
Safety and Inspection. Mr. Yannarelly is at vacant buildings and Mr. Zayne is a  
building inspector. Mr. Zayne manages the code compliance inspections for the City.  
We’ve had a chance to look over the materials that you've submitted. I think that  
you're well on the way there and really loved that you were able to secure that power of  
attorney so that you can move forward with the decision making more smoothly on  
that. How did that all go?  
Mr. Savasten- Ms.Savasten: Yeah. That's good. We have gotten taken care off.  
Moermond: Yeah, I like that. I'm wondering, I see we have new… Well, we have an  
affidavit, available funds, and documents from Expedition Credit Union. It appears that  
these funds are in Mr. Carl Burger's name. I'm wondering and I have an old account  
statement or one that was submitted, I am not sure how old it is. But the one that was  
submitted doesn't have a name attached to it and doesn't reflect that there's enough  
money to do the projects. Looking for some back up on the money being available.  
Also, I wanted to check in with you about your ability to access the funds to do the  
rehab. The power of attorney lets you make the decisions, but it doesn't give you the  
check book as it were. I'm wondering how you've worked that out or what you're  
proposing on that. I'll just kick it over to you folks to kind of, I guess, share where  
you're at with things.  
Mr. Savasten: Well, it was one battle at a time. The power of attorney was the first  
battle. So, yeah, we, you know, reading between the lines and again, it's my fault.  
When I was at the Credit Union, I just want to get the power turned down and I should  
have gotten new bank statements. But the banker was arguing with me. I took my  
battles when I could get them. He understands what the City needed to see. He was  
backing up uncle Carl. Yesterday, it dawned on me I should have probably pursue that  
the next couple days to get that taken care of. That’s my fault, I apologize. We do  
have the account numbers, but Iike [Joan] said that probably doesn't mean anything. I  
had a conversation with Karl last night. I will get that over to you by the end of the  
week. We'll get you the new account statements. There is also a checking account  
and a couple money market account that is pulling his funds from. I will figure it out  
and get those over to you.  
Moermond: Okay. What do you think about how you're going to tackle him, paying  
these trades people's bills? Are you foreseeing issues there? Cause I kind of do. I'm  
wondering if you do and what kind of thought you've given on how you're going to  
approach that situation.  
Ms. Savasten: I don't see any issue, Dale, do you? We've been very upfront about  
everything, and he's been very agreeable.  
Mr. Savasten: Yeah, he’s been very aggregable.  
Ms. Savasten: And you showed him all the numbers. So, he's not surprised by  
anything. We're not keeping him; we’re being very upfront.  
Mr. Savasten: Even last night, we had a conversation for 2 hours on why things cost so  
much money and showing him what all the contractors are telling us. So, he is fine with  
Moermond: All right, we have an update is schedule, and we have an updated financial  
affidavit, but we need the account information. We have a bid for the wall, a bid from  
Carpi Mechanical, and then Retro Electric. Those are done. I know that you folks are  
doing a lot of the building items outside of that retaining wall on your own. Are you  
doing all the ones on the code compliance list? And I know that you were  
deconstructing, shall I say so that some items and the code compliance wouldn't need  
to be done. Can you talk a little bit more about how you're tackling that list? If there's  
an outside contractor involved that we would need to see a bid for?  
Mr. Savasten: So, all the finish work and stuff we're doing ourselves. The last big one,  
Mitch, with Good Guys Plumbing. Because again, we had a contractor a plumber that  
we work with in the south metro and he decided that because we missed our start  
timeline, he just said it wasn't worth it. He gave me this gentleman's name and he lives  
in Saint Paul and works in Saint Paul. Anyhow, he's met with the City Inspector, the  
plumbing inspector twice now. I was really pushing him to pull the permit yesterday  
before our meeting, but his insurance has to be updated with the City. He is dealing  
with his plumbing insurance right now since it wasn’t up to date with the City. So that's  
why that permit has not been pulled yet. Will, at Retro pulled his permit yesterday, and  
Ryan, with Carty Mechanicals pulled his permit.  
Moermond: Okay, I am going to roll you back on the permit situation. Here is the deal  
that a warm air permit was issued to Carp in error. Yeah. And then they have another  
permit, a mechanical that’s under review, it’s a gas permit. Here's the thing, until the  
City Council gives you a grant of time to do the work, you are not going to be able to  
pull permits. The one has left to the gates, and it could be canceled. I guess I would  
ask the department not to do that, and to just let it sit. But you procedurally should  
have your house in order. Here, in the hearing process before you get your permits. I  
hate to put us in a position, and I don't think we're there. But where the city has issued  
permits for a house that the council has and voted to not demo. You know, let's get  
that vote taking care if so, you have your time and then do the next step up getting the  
permits pulled and executing on the work side of it, which I can work with you to get  
this on as quickly as possible.  
Mr. Savasten: Yes, I misunderstood that, and I apologize for that. That's why I was  
pushing hard to get these guys to get permits to get moving because we do have a  
timeline to get out of this house very quickly. That's why I am pushing hard to get this.  
Whatever we need to do to get you guys and The Council approval to move forward, I  
guess quickly. If its account numbers, I guess we will get on that today and drop what  
we're doing. If I reschedule these guys and I'm not going to meet my time and I just  
don't have the time. I would need to get more contractors lined up. Again, I am trying to  
speed people in my timeline. I apologize. I just now we know that like other case.  
Moermond: Yeah, and for us it when somebody has a 0% complete at 6 months, you  
know, I'm sure you understand that we're very careful that all the I's are dotted and T's  
are crossed before another 6 months is given the clean that up. I am just saying, you  
know, we need to go through our process here. As soon as these things are done, I'm  
happy to get on the council agenda as fast as possible. I I'm trying to pull up the file  
and our computer system to check where we are at with the performance deposit  
situation. And it looks like it's going to eventually think there. So we talked that you  
have forfeited 5 and then a new 5 would need to be posted. I'm assuming that you've  
done that. The computer system is not working with me. And that was done on May,  
2nd, my staff are telling me so that part is taking care of great. All right.  
Mr. Savasten: So, going back to the finish work. Basically the inside of the house,  
here's what we have been doing. I'm just painting the upstairs to basically put  
together, putting new cabinet, and new bath vanity. Completing those pieces. Other  
than that, it's just buttoning up the code compliance list. Basically, unfinished  
basement at this point and just doing all the exterior like landscaping and retaining wall  
Moermond: We will need you to pull a building permit on that. That will still need to get  
checked out and we'll look for that to happen. That would need to happen before your  
code compliance certificate would be issued as for this case it would be Clint Zayne  
and to have his eyes on and make sure that everything’s copasetic. What were you  
going to ask, sir?  
Mr. Savasten: So, meaning we need to pull permits for the kitchen remodel and the  
bathroom. Would that be for the trim work and stuff?  
Moermond: I'm going to say that you need to pull a permit and that permit needs to be  
for the code compliance list. That’s something that they're really accustomed to  
handling there. How you came into compliance is to remove some of these things. But  
you're really saying you're coming into compliance with what that inspection report is  
saying needs to be done. There are alternative ways to do that. That's how you're  
approaching it. That's totally fine. But we're going back to what that original list is and  
is it now going to work out? You know, it would that list, as we discussed, was  
assuming that you would want to keep things like the finished basement. If you're  
pulling those finishes, you know, different codes apply. We have you becoming  
compliant. Just not in the way it was originally envisioned, but that the permit is  
building permit code compliance and Mr. Zayne can take it from there.  
Zayne: Yeah, you bet, when you get your clearance through The Council there you  
know the building permit an electrical permit. You'll need those yet. You guys aren't  
going to be living in the home when you're done, right?  
Mr. Savasten: No, it’s going to go up for sale.  
Zayne: Okay. So, then you will need the licensed electrician, to pull the electrical.  
Yeah, one thing that I would ask really quick is. You have submitted a spreadsheet of  
the different costs of what was going to be done on the house there. And i was  
reviewing the spreadsheet here, you know, the numbers are in the blue column where  
you show the difference. They are kind of all over the place and we don't end up with a  
total anywhere that shows, you know what the total cost it would be. You've got your 2  
main columns of budget and then your next column, which shows the actual cost. And  
then the final column shows the difference. Some will have a positive difference and  
some a negative difference. But when I'm looking through this, sometimes you added  
when you should have been subtracting and sometimes you subtracted where you  
should have been adding. And there was, you know, the spreadsheet obviously isn't  
doing this automatically for you. There are some lines that just have numbers in there  
that don't even have anything associated with the row. I wondered if you could clean  
that up and get those numbers to Jive and then resubmit that.  
Mr. Savasten: Yeah, that's my fault. I didn't even look at to be honest. I was in such a  
Moermond: Okay, so there's 3 things and we're good to go and it sounds like you are  
hot to get this under way. That's good news on our end. Those things that will be  
looking for first is the account information and second is a cleaned-up spreadsheet.  
What am I forgetting? I think is it just those 2 things? I think you just those 2 things.  
Okay. So what I'm going to do is we can get this in front of city council as soon as  
next week and get you a grant of time if we have that information in our office so well,  
we'll look for that.  
Mr. and Ms. Savasten - OK, sounds good. Alright, thank you.  
Moermond: OK, and just please say if you can get it to us before Tuesday, that's just  
super helpful. I'm trying to get through these things on a Wednesday with everybody  
throwing a ton of stuff at us. It's super hard. So you know, that will just make our lives  
easier if we get it at a day or two before the 17th. thank you. All right. Sounds like  
we're almost there.  
Referred to the City Council due back on 5/10/2023  
11:00 a.m. Hearings  
Summary & Vehicle Abatement Orders  
Appeal of Earl Carlson to a Vehicle Abatement Order at 1784 CARROLL  
Deny the appeal, noting the nuisance is abated.  
Minutes pending.  
Referred to the City Council due back on 5/17/2023  
Appeal of William Quinlan to a Summary Abatement Order at 1042 LAWSON  
Deny the appeal and grant extension to June 1, 2023 for compliance.  
Note LHO amended recommendation to grant extension to May 17, 2023.  
Referred to the City Council due back on 5/17/2023  
Orders To Vacate - Code Enforcement  
Appeal of Wesley Gakuo to a Notice of Condemnation as Unfit for Human  
Habitation and Order to Vacate at 0 BUSH AVENUE, vacant lot (Parcel  
Layover to May 16, 2023 at 11:30 am for further discussion.  
Laid Over to the Legislative Hearings due back on 5/16/2023  
1:00 p.m. Hearings  
Vacant Building Registrations  
Appeal of Michael VanGrinsven, RE/MAX Prodigy o/b/o Secretary of Veterans  
Affairs, to a Vacant Building Registration Notice at 1622 BARCLAY STREET.  
Deny the appeal to be released from the VB program, and recommend changing  
property from Cat 2 VB to Cat 1 (CCI is not required).  
Referred to the City Council due back on 5/24/2023  
1:30 p.m. Hearings  
Orders To Vacate - Fire Certificate of Occupancy  
Appeal of Brian Norelius to a Revocation of Fire Certificate of Occupancy and  
RLH VO 23-12  
Order to Vacate at 842 VANDALIA STREET. (To refer back to April 25, 2023  
Legislative Hearing)  
Grant an extension to October 15, 2023 for compliance.  
Referred to the City Council due back on 5/24/2023  
2:00 p.m. Hearings  
Fire Certificates of Occupancy  
Appeal of Linda Aiken to a Fire Inspection Correction Notice at 1364 HEWITT  
Grant the appeal and release the property from the Fire Certificate of Occupancy  
Referred to the City Council due back on 5/24/2023